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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 11:41 pm 
Marquis
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:shrug: everyone's allowed their own voting decision. :-)

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 Post subject: Re: USA Politics
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 11:49 pm 
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true,but I think in this case he's just being Fives for the sake of being Fives :D

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:02 am 
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Not trying to start anything batman55555, but how can you possibly vote for Romney, yet also support gay marriage?

Here's an article on Romney's thoughts on same-sex marriage and couples after Mass. voted to allow said marriages:
Quote:
Romney hadn't even previously fathomed that gay people had children. Boston Spirit magazine reported last month that when gay activists met with him in his office in 2004, as Romney was backing a failed constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage in the state, Romney remarked, "I didn't know you had families." Julie Goodridge, lead plaintiff in the landmark case that won marriage rights for gays and lesbians before the Supreme Judicial Court, asked what she should tell her 8-year-old daughter about why the governor would block the marriage of her parents. According to Goodridge, Romney responded,"I don't really care what you tell your adopted daughter. Why don't you just tell her the same thing you've been telling her the last eight years."


The guy is a tool. No understanding in the slightest as to what us average people go through on a day to day basis.



----

I'm a bit nervous. I want Obama to win, but I'm kinda feeling like the Republican propaganda machine was more powerful than the Dem one.


Go Obama!

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 Post subject: Re: USA Politics
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:55 am 
Knight
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Lex Talionis wrote:
true,but I think in this case he's just being Fives for the sake of being Fives :D


He's the fucking spiderman to my Venom. Arghhhh!!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: USA Politics
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:01 am 
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I just love how you're each others foil,you two are more like buddy cops than rivals through :)

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:21 am 
Knight
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I shake my fist at you Lex!

I don't understand how someone ends up like him though! It's like fighting your mirror image in the original Mortal Kombat. Whenever I see he's last posted I take a moment to centre myself and then click on the thread. And then low and behold he's got the complete opposite opinion. It's like someone is messing with me on purpose!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:33 am 
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Came across this article today. . Definitely makes you think.. Spoilered for size.


Spoiler: show
Obama Votes for Romney

by Stephen Lendman

"Well, he might have," said Mark Crispin Miller on his blog site. He doesn't know. Nor do other voters. Corporate owned, programmed and manipulated electronic voting machines control things.

The Carter Center monitors elections globally. It refuses to do so in America because free, fair and open standards don't exist.

Jimmy Carter calls Venezuela's electoral process "the best in the world." He said America's is "one of the worst." He cited money power controlling them.

Others call US elections shams. They lack legitimacy. Nothing about them reflects democracy. Duopoly power controls things. People have no say. Half the electorate usually opts out for good reason.

Candidates are pre-selected. Key outcomes are predetermined. Media scoundrels suppress truth. Information voters most need goes unreported. Horse managed news and race journalism substitute.

Voter disenfranchisement is rife. Millions are peremptorily stricken from rolls. Violations prohibited under the 1965 Voting Rights Act are commonplace.

It prohibits states from imposing any "voting qualification or prerequisite to voting, or standard, practice, or procedure (that may) deny or abridge the right of any citizen….to vote on account of race or color."

Intimidation not to vote or illegal deterrence happens often. Vote caging delists minorities for not answering "do not forward" registered mail sent to prior residences.

Millions of Americans can't vote because of past criminal records, no matter how minor. Millions more can't because they're incarcerated.

Elections are privatized. Corporate America runs them. Touchscreen electronic machines control voting. They're used to steal. It's easy. Manipulation controls things.

Vetting isn't done. Verifiable receipts aren't provided. Votes cast for candidate A can count twice for candidate B. There's no way to check.

Corporate run machines are inherently flawed. They're designed that way. They're used to steal.

Investigative journalist Greg Palast said "get ready for massive voter fraud." He expects 5.9 million "spoiled" or otherwise not counted votes.

On November 5, Roger Johnson headlined "How I Hacked An Electronic Voting Machine."

"What do you need to rig an election," he asked? "A basic knowledge of electronics and $30 worth of RadioShack gear" works fine.

Imagine how much easier it is by manipulating software to elect corporate choices.

Johnson heads the Argonne National Laboratory Vulnerability Assessment Team. He knows how simple it is to steal votes.

In Harper's November issue, Victoria Collier headlined "How to Rig an Election," saying "The GOP aims to paint the country red."

Rigging is as old as elections. Today it's done with electronic ease. Privatized elections were instituted without public knowledge or consent. Direct Recording Electronic (DRE) voting leaves no paper trail.

High-tech ballot box stuffing follows. It's done secretly and not reported. Collier calls it the "electoral equivalent of a drone strike." In 1996, Republican Chuck Hagel suspiciously defeated Nebraska's popular Democrat governor Ben Nelson.

At stake was a US Senate seat. Polls suggested a close race. Hagel won by 15 points. Few Nebraskans knew about Hagel's ties. He was part owner, chairman and CEO of Election Systems & Software (ES&S).

It counted Nebraska's votes electronically. At the time it was called American Information Systems. AIS' parent company founder, Michael McCarthy, was Hagel's campaign treasurer. His easy victory made winning suspect. His own company installed him.

Hagel, in fact, never disclosed his business ties. A Senate Ethics Committee investigation was requested. It was rejected. America's system is so corrupted, voters "have no ability to know with certainty who wins any given race, from dogcatcher to president."

Nor can ballot initiatives and referenda results be verified. On November 6, major issues are at stake in different states. They include fracking, GMO labeling, abortion and gay marriage rights, as well as real electoral reform.

Corporate controlled faith-based elections have no legitimacy. They assure dark age democracy. In other words, none at all. In 2003, Ohio-based Diebold's CEO, Walden O'Dell, promised and delivered Ohio for George Bush.

Kerry defeated him in Ohio and nationally. Vote tallies claimed otherwise. Nearly 17 million new voters registered to participate. Surveys showed most supported Kerry. Bush's approval rating hovered around 40%.

Up to then, no president since Harry Truman won a second term with less than 50%. Final tallies showed Bush got 11.6 million more votes than in 2000. He defeated Kerry by three million. Florida and Ohio made the difference.

Mark Crispin Miller's book "Fooled Again: The Real Case for Electoral Reform" discussed massive electoral fraud. He exposed progressive media denial in publications like Nation magazine.

Ohio and Florida were stolen in 2000 and 2004. Pollster Lou Harris called Ohio 2004 as dirty as he ever saw. Exit polls gave Kerry an insurmountable lead.

Final tallies in 30 states differed from exit polls. They're known for accuracy. Gallup vice president David Moore said they consistently show stronger Democrat support than election results. Fraud explains why.

In April 2011, Jonathan Simon's article headlined "To the American Media: Time to Face the Reality of Election Rigging," saying:

"How does the Big Lie flourish and prosper?" It persists behind a wall "of denial….The gruesome truth is that American elections can be rigged and are being rigged because the American media treats election rigging as something that - all evidence notwithstanding -could never happen here."

It's commonplace. Media scoundrels won't discuss it. Some progressive ones won't touch it. Neither will prominent figures who know better.

Most cheated Democrats back off. Kerry told Mark Crispin Miller he won in 2004. Publicly he denied saying it. Few politicians are profiles in courage. They'd rather grab what they can and stay silent.

Without real electoral reform, legitimate elections aren't impossible. Rampant fraud made Bush president twice. He lost both times.

In Florida, Governor Jeb Bush assured it. So did Secretary of State Katherine Harris in 2000. For services rendered, she became congressional representative for Florida's 13th district. Electronic ease can install anyone.

In 2002, Republicans regained Senate control. Diebold voting machines defeated Democrat Senator Max Cleland. He had a comfortable lead but lost. Neocon Saxby Chamblis replaced him.

On November 6, will Obama or Romney win? Polls show Obama with a slight lead. Does it matter if big money wants Romney? Wall Street does. Major banks are his largest contributors.

Corporate controlled electronic voting machine companies will have final say. On October 20, Forbes magazine headlined "Romney Family Investment Ties to Voting Machine Company That Could Decide The Election Causing Concern."

On October 24, the Washington Post reported the same thing. So did Free Press.org on September 27. Texas-based Hart InterCivic provides voting machines for local governments nationwide. It has ties to Bain Capital, Romney's former company.

Most of its directors come from private equity firm, HIG Capital. It's heavily invested in Hart. Who is HIG Capital, asked Free Press? Founder Tony Tamer used to work at Bain.

Two other partner/directors (John Bolduc and Douglas Berman) are Romney bundlers "along with former Bain and HIG manager Brian Shortsleeve."

HIG Capital employees contributed $338,000 to Romney's campaign. Bain gave him only $268,000. "Will Mitt's cronies steal our democracy the way they stole our jobs," asked Free Press?

It discussed the Spanish-based voting machine company Scytl contracted to count 25% of the November 6 vote. It has Booz Allen, venture capital and intelligence community ties. It "emerged as the most mysterious election counting company in this presidential election."

Its Baltimore, MD sales office operates from a "virtual office which has a shared secretary and serves as a mail drop."

"The ties of Hart Intercivic to Romney fund-raisers and Bain alumni should cause concern in the Obama re-election campaign. So, should the mysterious Spanish owned company, Scytl, with a US operation that seems to be an front."

Close elections favor Republicans. Rigged ones make it easy. Will money power combined with electronic manipulation decide who'll be president and win key Senate, House, Gubernatorial, and other state and local races?

Expect the worst. It's likely. The best democracy money can buy wins every time. It's done with electronic ease. It's the American way.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:56 am 
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DrainBamaged wrote:
I shake my fist at you Lex!

I don't understand how someone ends up like him though! It's like fighting your mirror image in the original Mortal Kombat. Whenever I see he's last posted I take a moment to centre myself and then click on the thread. And then low and behold he's got the complete opposite opinion. It's like someone is messing with me on purpose!

safe to say you're not the only one :)

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:21 am 
Marquis
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Shhhhh Lex. Lets just bask in relief for a moment.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:42 pm 
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Well, the election is over. Locally, Washington State legalised marijuana (I don't do drugs, but I voted for it just because it seems like a waste of time/money for police to keep trying to stop people from doing this thing when they could be focusing on worse crime/drugs), and approved gay marriage (which I also voted for, I think they should have the same rights as everyone). I don't care about what Romney thinks about gay marriage, in this election I cared about 1 issue: mandatory health insurance. Nationally, the worst thing possible happened. People bash republicans for being rich people out of touch with average people, but Democrats (atleast the politicians) are just as bad, if not worse. Obama is a millionaire, even if he's not quite as rich as Romney, and he's just as out of touch. Sure, he apparently only made $789,674 in 2011 (down from over a million in 2010), but my family makes less than 2% of that. I mean, we're not on the street, we have an apartment and a few things (like cable) but my family doesn't have the money for health insurance, even if we cut off cable and did nothing but eat, sleep, and stay inside.

2014 is officially going to ruin my life. Great job, Obama, requiring people (like my family) who don't have the money get life insurance, and then making us pay if we don't get it. I'm 22, I've never had a job (and I doubt I'll have one by 2014), so that means I'm really going to be screwed. I'm honestly scared about what will happen to me. Do they still have debtor's prison? Are they going to lock me up for being a fat, jobless guy who can't afford health insurance? People are now going to have to pay a fine for being alive, wether through a monthly fee or a yearly one if you don't pay the monthly one. A lot of people are screwed, and I'm one of them. Romney could have gone through the streets beheading kittens, and I'd still have voted for him. So, for any americans here who voted for him, congratulations. Have fun driving your hybrid cars while drinking your fancy coffee (in a cup made from recycled materials, of course) and paying every tax Obama wants you to, while I'll be getting put away for the crime of not having money.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:37 am 
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theadirondackcoyote wrote:
@ Spaced - essentially that's what it turns into. This pointless squabbling isn't what I want to see any head of state doing, regardless of their political agenda. <_<



The choice between a right-wing agenda and a far right-wing agenda.

Really, i rather talk about their characters then about the absurde political landscape in the US.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:02 am 
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batman55555 wrote:

2014 is officially going to ruin my life. Great job, Obama, requiring people (like my family) who don't have the money get life insurance, and then making us pay if we don't get it. I'm 22, I've never had a job (and I doubt I'll have one by 2014), so that means I'm really going to be screwed. I'm honestly scared about what will happen to me. Do they still have debtor's prison? Are they going to lock me up for being a fat, jobless guy who can't afford health insurance? People are now going to have to pay a fine for being alive, wether through a monthly fee or a yearly one if you don't pay the monthly one. A lot of people are screwed, and I'm one of them. Romney could have gone through the streets beheading kittens, and I'd still have voted for him. So, for any americans here who voted for him, congratulations. Have fun driving your hybrid cars while drinking your fancy coffee (in a cup made from recycled materials, of course) and paying every tax Obama wants you to, while I'll be getting put away for the crime of not having money.



Bah, don't be such a sourpuss. Obamacare is a good thing, one step closer to the socialized medicine of Canada. There's no reason anybody should be without health coverage. Sure, you're gonna be required to have it, but the government is going to better regulate the cost of healthcare while also lowering requirements of government healthcare. Do you drive a car? You're required by law to have car insurance and if you don't you can be fined. Romney was completely out of touch with the average person, his whole 47% comment was ridiculous. Obama has a slightly more grounded, middle class upbringing. Romney is also a bigot. To quote Peter Griffin, "Gay people have every right to be married and miserable like the rest of us".
... And not to intrude but you say you're 22, never had a job, and doubt you'll have one in the next two years? That makes you part of that 47% that Romney has such great disdain for.

You should be glad that Romney didn't win, or else that family of yours would've been paying $2000 more in taxes a year, while the rich and business sectors got perks out the ass.



...


I'm starting to see why some forums I'm a member of have a strict no politics/religion policy.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:04 am 
Knight

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uh batman5555, so you know its within the realm of possibilities obamacare will change. there are a ton of states looking into how to not partake in it. and due to all that, perhaps something will change on the national level.

i dont like obamacare either, but i'd rather think of what i mentioned above as a possibility then elect a guy that publicly stated he don't care about half the country (google romney 47%), thinks the middle class are people making 200k, increases the odds of war in iran due to him being president, and wants to bring back a time when corporations and banks absolutely raped this country through deregulation.


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 7:38 pm 
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impulse wrote:

Bah, don't be such a sourpuss. Obamacare is a good thing, one step closer to the socialized medicine of Canada. There's no reason anybody should be without health coverage. Sure, you're gonna be required to have it, but the government is going to better regulate the cost of healthcare while also lowering requirements of government healthcare. Do you drive a car? You're required by law to have car insurance and if you don't you can be fined. Romney was completely out of touch with the average person, his whole 47% comment was ridiculous. Obama has a slightly more grounded, middle class upbringing. Romney is also a bigot. To quote Peter Griffin, "Gay people have every right to be married and miserable like the rest of us".
... And not to intrude but you say you're 22, never had a job, and doubt you'll have one in the next two years? That makes you part of that 47% that Romney has such great disdain for.

You should be glad that Romney didn't win, or else that family of yours would've been paying $2000 more in taxes a year, while the rich and business sectors got perks out the ass.
.


A sourpuss :shock: Really? I don't know about you, but owing the government money for living doesn't make me a sourpuss, it makes me poor. Also, I'm glad you brought the car thing up. I don't drive, so I'm not forced to get car insurance, since I don't have a car. You shouldn't get taxed for living. I don't care if Romney has disdain for me, I don't care if he came to my home and took a piss on my bed. I just don't want to possibly go to jail because I'm poor and can't get health insurance. I don't care about his 47% line, because I don't really disagree. At this point, I'd say I hate every democrat in this country, and thats probably near 47% (atleast of adults), and I wouldn'[t mind seeing them get screwed over for once. Obama is the one trying to put poor people on the street/in jail with this, not Romney.

This is something rich democrats (who are much worse than rich republicans) don't get. My family does not have the money for this, and we can't get it. Democrats seem to think that poor people can snap their fingers and get money to pay every little tax they can think up. Well, I got news for you, we can't. I'll take a war in Iran, I'll take deregulation, just don't put my family on the street/in jail. Socialism is evil, socialised medicine is the stupidest thing ever invented, and putting law abiding citizens into debtor's prision because Obama wants to force people to have something they don't need, or want. It wasn't voted for by the people, its a bunch of rich a-hole politicians, who won't be effected by it, who put it into law. You want socialised medicine, then move to Canada. Don't put my family in the street because you think we should get something we will never use, with money we don't have. How do democrats not understand the concept of people not having the money for something like this? There is no one more delusional then a democrat, especially the richer they are.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:36 pm 
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sourpuss is apparently the perfect term for you how you are telling people that didnt vote the way you wanted that you hate them all and that they should move to canada. along with the other derogatory crap.

and are you kidding me about how you pick and choose what to respond too and then making whatever up (debter's prison? come on, there is no such thing)



impulse, talking about politics and religion can be fine as long as people dont get bitter about whatever and at least use educated and researched talk to back up their premise.


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